almost time to go home

[hermionesviolin]

Prompted by conversation with musesfool about remixredux:

[Poll #701226]

Also: Nicole and I are going out for happy hour (followed by dinner) tomorrow [Friday! Huzzah!] after work. So clearly I'm going to spend my commercial breaks tonight flipping through my bartending book to remind me of what options exist and what's actually in assorted girly drinks. Sidenote: Mary Alice and I were discussing Scotch at lunch today. Good times.

Comments

[hedy.livejournal.com]

do you think you might look for a bartending job?

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

It's a definite possibility.

[alixtii.livejournal.com]

When I read a remix, I do read the original, but I usually read it second. Just wanted to make that clear.

I never have any idea what to order that's alcoholic. I need one of those. (And am not afraid of looking girly, especially if it'll get me a drink with something which overpowers the taste of alcohol.)

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

In our conversation (http://musesfool.livejournal.com/1078368.html?thread=18062176#t18062176), musesfool said, "I generally read the remix first and if it interests me, I go back and read the original (unless I've already read the original, pre-Remix, which happens)." I figure if people like a Remix they're likely to check out the original, but her comment about reading the Remix first totally threw me because I have adaptation issues of epic proportions so starting with the Original text is huge for me.

I am all about alcoholic drinks wherein you can't actually taste the alcohol. Honestly I wish all the yummy drinks were available in nonalcoholic versions 'cause alcohol just makes me tired so the whole getting inebriated thing holds no appeal for me.

[likeadeuce.livejournal.com]

wisdomeagle linked me over here.

I also tend to read remixes first -- I actually like trying to guess what the original story was like, based on the remix. To me, that's more fun! I was honestly shocked by the number of people saying they made sure to read the original first -- nothing WRONG with it, it just never occurred to me that people would approach it that way. I honestly might have done the story I did very differently if I had realized that most people would read the original first; (ie, I spend time building suspense re: something that is much less suspenseful if you've seen the original!)

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Hmm. While I can certainly understand enjoying the remix as its own stand-alone, it never occurred to me that people might enjoy trying to guess what the original story was like based on the remix.

I honestly might have done the story I did very differently if I had realized that most people would read the original first; (ie, I spend time building suspense re: something that is much less suspenseful if you've seen the original!)

I don't know what story you wrote, but this made me think of The Ballad of Charles Whitman (Apocalypse Remix) (http://remix.illuminatedtext.com/dbfiction.php?fiction_id=506), Original Story: Revelations (http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?user=liz_marcs&keyword=Revelations+%28BtVS%3B+PG%29&filter=all). I read "Revelations" first, and reading "The Ballad of Charles Whitman" afterward I admit it did feel a bit slow because I knew what was going to happen and, like, I wanted the other shoe to hurry up and drop. But because the story was in Xander's POV and starting at the beginning I knew there had to be build-up and I appreciated that the remix author was so thorough about that.

[likeadeuce.livejournal.com]

You know, I think what this conversation is showing is that people went into this exercise with a whole lot of different ideas about what a remix is and that affects both how we write and how we read. Probably we're all reading assuming that people approached remix the same way that we did -- as I mentioned in the other thread, I was seeing it as a "retelling" or "adaptation" -- in which case, reading the original can be interesting and enlightening, but isn't necessary to enjoy the derivative work.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Probably we're all reading assuming that people approached remix the same way that we did

Yup. (And it's valuable to learn that this assumption is inaccurate.)

I was seeing it as a "retelling" or "adaptation" -- in which case, reading the original can be interesting and enlightening, but isn't necessary to enjoy the derivative work.

I agree that a lot of the best remixes stand on their own (though often one can't get the full resonance without reading the original).

I said to another commenter on this post that:

Part of my insistence on reading the original fic first is my knowledge that I become very attached to the first way I experience a text, so if I read a remix first it would in some ways feel like the "definitive" take on the events that it and the original were tackling, and that feels wrong to me.

I tend to think that the best remixes can stand beside the original as an alternative point-of-view on the same events, or an alternative way that events could have played out or whatever.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

I honestly might have done the story I did very differently if I had realized that most people would read the original first; (ie, I spend time building suspense re: something that is much less suspenseful if you've seen the original!)

The reveals are up, so now I know which remix you wrote. Turns out I read it, but it and the original were so rich that I was still processing and didn't feedback. But given this comment I wanted to mention that reading your remix after the original I never felt like, "Cut the suspense already; I know what's gonna happen" or anything like that. You made such changes to the original that I was constantly interested both to see what the characters would do next and also to see how what happened next would fit or not with the plotline of the original.

[likeadeuce.livejournal.com]

Hey, thanks, I'm glad you liked them!

I made a long post talking about the remix process here -- also explaining the specifics to this story. Partly I did this b/c I felt like I was kind of snippy on the comments to this thread and I didn't mean to be. I think I was just getting frustrated trying to talk about it without being able to go into specifics!

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Oh, I didn't think you were being snippy in here at all.

I definitely understand the frustration of having to be vague, and I'll try to read your post when I have a chance. Thanks for the link. Discussion is yay.

[escritoireazul.livejournal.com]

Sometimes? If I can, I prefer to read the original first and then the remix, but often I'm rushed and trying to do recs before the names are announced, so I don't always have the chance.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

I'm usually reading Remix well after the fact, so the Reveal is a non-issue. This is the first year I'm actually reading any of them before the Reveal.

[helholden.livejournal.com]

I never want to bother with reading the original first, but I always read it afterwards.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Huh. I find it so strange that you would call reading the original a "bother" because to me it's so huge to read the original first in large part because then I can see what the Remixer did with the original.

[helholden.livejournal.com]

Oh, I don't consider it a bother. I always read it. I just want to read the one I've heard of first, which has so far always been the remix. I'm not concerned with knowing ahead of time how it was altered. In fact, remixes are usually better read first. At least for me.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Interesting. I have huge adaptation issues, so I always wanna read the original first, and I adore that Remix Redux is set up in such a way that it is easy to get to the original from the remix.

Personally I hate reading a remix and crediting the remixer with ideas that were in fact original to the original author, and I just generally feel like I get more out of a remix if I'm seeing what they did with the original (unless the remix doesn't add very much to the original, but then well it's not a very good remix).

[helholden.livejournal.com]

I never saw it as giving credit to first one who I read it from, since I know that the original idea wasn't theirs. But if I read the original first, then the remix won't have the weight of a proper fic behind it. You know what I mean? I know it's technically not an original creation, but I want it to matter as much as the original when I read it. Instead of just being a "copy fic" or something. So I read it first, knowing that if I read it afterwards, it won't have the same power because the original will overshadow it.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

But a lot of times a remix adds a lot to a story that wasn't in the original, so there can be plenty of stuff in a remix that the remixer invented (like a "missing scene" fanfic adding to a source text).

So I read it first, knowing that if I read it afterwards, it won't have the same power because the original will overshadow it.

Part of my insistence on reading the original fic first is my knowledge that I become very attached to the first way I experience a text, so if I read a remix first it would in some ways feel like the "definitive" take on the events that it and the original were tackling, and that feels wrong to me.

I tend to think that the best remixes can stand beside the original as an alternative point-of-view on the same events, or an alternative way that events could have played out or whatever.

[helholden.livejournal.com]

True, true. I have see that before.

Most of the time I think I just read. I don't often like to complicate things.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

:) Complicating's pretty much what I do.

[wisdomeagle]

I agree with you on this one! I always start with the original; if I can't get into it I might or might not read the remix, but, definitely, the original is the starting place.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

*loves on you* The results of this poll make me sad (though I suppose I should be grateful that ~half the respondents agree with me -- i.e., it could be worse).

Dude, I miss you.

[wisdomeagle]

*hugs*

You too. *resolves to be more active reader in your journal*

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Rawk!

I am a big fan of discussion in my LJ. (And I feel bad that I haven't been very commenty in your LJ, but BSC isn't something I'm hardcore about, and I've definitely been doing a lot of the "Hmm, given enough time I might be able to formulate a comment on this, but I don't really have time, so moving along now.")

[liz-marcs.livejournal.com]

Heee! I saw this today.

And I meant to say: Thank you for reading my original when you read my remix. :-) I appreciated your FB (and do agree with it).

The one thing the remix is good for is it does bring people in to read older stories or stories you tend to forget about. But I do try to read the originals whenever I read the remixes.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

:)

[Sorry, I feel like I should have a more substantial response, but I'm fading.]

[sodzilla.livejournal.com]

Pray forgive me, I know I speak from utter ignorance, but what's a remix in this context?

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

The UserInfo of remixredux explains it somewhat. Does that help at all?

[sodzilla.livejournal.com]

Oh yes, I get it now. Thanks! Sounds interesting...

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

It definitely is. I encourage you to check out the Remix archives; there's a lot of very good fic there.

[isiscolo.livejournal.com]

Argh! My answer is "sometimes"!

If I vaguely remember having read the original or if I know or respect the writing of the author of the original I read it first. Otherwise I usually read the remix first, and then I read the original if I liked the idea of the remix.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

Oh, I'm sorry. I assumed everyone had a system of either reading the original first or reading the remix first, so I didn't gradate the response options.

I'm usually reading Remix well after the Reveal and I definitely begin with fics whose originals or remixes are written by authors whose work I trust, since I only have so much time and I wanna maximize my likelihood of reading quality fic, but the which-to-read-first issue is for me an issue far broader than specific authors.

[wingstar.livejournal.com]

I'm the same as musesfool; I go back and read the original if I enjoyed the remix.

[paranoidangel]

It actually never occurred to me that people might read the original first. I always treat the Remixes as stories that stand alone when I read them. But I go and read the originals afterwards. If the Remixer has added things then its interesting to see where they got them from. Sometimes when I look at the original I think "yes!" because the two read together so well.

Mind you, there are times when I come to the remix having read the original pre-remix. Then it's really interesting to see what the remixer has done, so I can see the point of reading the original first.

Perhaps in the future I should try a bit of both.

[ff-shiprecs.livejournal.com]

I like to read the remix first and then the original. In large part, because remixers rarely choose bad or dull stories to remix so I can pretty much guarantee that I'll like the original. I don't want to feel disappointed in the remix; I'd like to judge it on it's own merits first.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

I do think good remixes can stand on their own, but I'm also largely interested in what the remix does with the original, and I would feel like I was missing a lot if I read the remix without knowing the original -- like reading a fairytale retelling of a fairytale you weren't familiar with.

[ff-shiprecs.livejournal.com]

like reading a fairytale retelling of a fairytale you weren't familiar with
But isn't that what most people do? See the Disney movie first? ;)

I think I tend to view remixes more like remakes; it's a lot easier to enjoy the the remade movie if you haven't seen the original.

[hermionesviolin.livejournal.com]

:P I have never been a big endorser of the Disney movies, and it makes me sad that people don't always know how the movies have changed the tales they drew from, that the Disney movies become the definitive version of the tale for them. (If you choose a version as your definitive, knowing the alternatives, fine; but informed choice is a huge thing for me.)

And oh god the idea of movie remakes makes me cry blood tears. The epitome of the movie industry shunning any originality and yet refusing to just give it up and say so.